by tashmcgill | Apr 22, 2009 | Church, Uncategorized, youth ministry
Ok, so a couple of weeks back, I posted a review of Mark Riddle‘s book, Inside the Mind of Youth Pastors. You can read that review here.
Part #2 was Mark graciously agreeing to answer some additional questions that I had around the book. There’s a blog tour on – you can find the details over here.
ED. I really really encourage you to get a hold of this book – it’s worth it.
So – here’s the interview!
1. So what does a ministry/church consultant really do? I guess it’s a bit self-promoting, but what do you think a church can gain from engaging with a consultant like yourself, in this hiring business?
Tash, thanks for having me visit your blog. This is officially my first kiwi interview. I’m looking forward to hearing your friends.
To your question, People generally hire a ministry consultant because they want a future different from their past and they recognize that the tools, perspectives, answers and responses to situations they’ve used in the past will only continue to lead them back in to past results. Sometimes this means the church approaching me is in crisis other times church leaders want to maintain a growing edge. My experience has been that the church leaders who invite me alongside their churches are smarter than I am, more experienced than I am, and very competent leaders, however they see the need to have an outside perspective and encouragement as they are working through a variety of situations. I can’t speak for them, but I hope that churches who work with The Riddle Group (the organization I lead) experience all of these positive things.
What’s been a great success story for your work?
I love this question. I think success is measured by the stories we tell. In brief, churches that invite us to partner with them begin to see themselves as responsible for the church in every way shape and form. I think about First Christian Church in small stable rural community who took 14 to take inventory of their youth ministry and the revolving door of their youth pastor position. They thought it was dodgy to outsource the spiritual formation of their children and youth to a staff person. They did ultimately hired someone, but the church still owns every bit of the youth ministry. The Youth Pastor’s job is to invest in the 5 people on a leadership team, spend time with kids and spend time with God. The people of the church take care of everything. There are a lot stories like that from around the states in all kinds of churches. Lots of stories of freeing the church to be the church, and staff to be themselves. It’s exciting to be a part of.
2. You talk about unwritten/unspoken expectations of youth pastors from churches. On the flipside – what are some of the most common inner motivations going on for youth pastors, and their misguided expectations of church communities? For example, a lot of younger youth pastors go into ministry with some unrealistic expectations about what ministry entails… and often don’t think that the admin & reporting aspect of what they do really matters as much as spending time with kids. Are those motivations & expectations something we can work out with each other? How should I go about challenging a youthworker about their own motivations and expectations?
Such an interesting question. It seems that how people spend their time in ministry is an expression of a mixture of what they feel is important, what they are good at, and what they love to do. There are a lot of youth pastors who get into youth ministry to relive or continue a positive experience they personally had. These are generally folks who have only seen or experienced the products of youth ministry above the surface. Few have experienced the kind of administrative load it takes to make youth ministry happen. A young youth pastor never had to write a bulletin announcement, make a budget, communicate with a volunteer team, run a program, engage parents in meaningful ways, or develop a system that can support healthy youth ministry. Of course that’s something of a generalization. I will add that there aren’t many folks are as predictable and detailed oriented to communicate well to a church and then be spontaneous and relational with kids. Youth ministry that revolves around an individual is destined to struggle or not be sustainable. As per the expectations of youth workers who only want to spend time with kids. We’ve spent the last 15 years of youth ministry really talking up relationships with kids, which has been interpreted by many youth pastors as their responsibility.
If I can say it bluntly. I don’t think most churches should pay people to spend time with kids or to be the primary voice in their lives on anything. Youth workers who only want to hang out with kids, without empowering the church to love kids are doing a disservice to the students they are leading. Most of these youth workers will say they can’t get the church to be involved. In 99% of the cases I’ve experience the problem hasn’t been the congregation, but the youth pastor unintentionally excluding the church from the ministry. There are some exceptions to this. My advice: Don’t live like you are one of them.
3. There can be huge amounts of security involved in why churches employ youthworkers – they want someone to assign trust, responsibility, accountability and someone with whom, the buck can stop. Often, those are not things church boards are willing to entrust a volunteer, because there’s still an element of ‘out of our hands’ about it. Sometimes this is motivated by wanting to “first do no harm”. But, how does a church or volunteer work through this with church leadership so that the kind of healthy youth ministry you describe in the book, can exist and be birthed?
I’ve seen this tendency too.
First, I think it’s an illusion to think that paying someone gives people more control over people. If it does, it’s not the kind of control you want to have.
Second, it’s naïve to think that hiring a staff person to lead a youth ministry will “do no harm”. In systems thinking we say that cause and effect can be separate form each other in time and space. That’s is to say that it’s very difficult to connect the dots between the decisions we make as church leaders and the consequences of those decisions months and years later outside of our perception. In this instance I’d ask, could it be that hiring a youth pastor is the most harmful thing we can do as church leaders?
Third, there a huge assumption behind this kind of behavior as well. If I am motivated to “do no harm” and want strict accountability for youth ministry in a church I am inherently limiting ministry in unintentional ways. It’s the kind of question churches ask when they believe that their youth ministry is completely wrapped up in a few programs and activities. We call this youth ministry. But this isn’t youth ministry. These are only small expressions of youth ministry is a healthy church. Great churches see youth ministry as something that is everybody’s job. It simply can’t be controlled. Parent’s are inviting friends to disciple their children. Men are inviting teens to play golf with them, maybe teaching them how. Ministry to teens is always happening. It’s messy. It’s random. It’s spontaneous. It’s intentional. Youth ministry is the job of the church, all the time. When we seclude it t
o a program, we are no longer doing youth ministry. We are doing something else, in the name of ministry.
4. Seems like there is a fine line between developing healthy mentoring relationship within a staff team and a youth pastor simply being an extension of the senior pastor’s hands and feet in many churches. How can a youth pastor actively foster healthy relationship with their senior, in such a way that they can grow into peer relationship? Or is this an issue that goes back to the core of how we view church staffing? What perspectives do we need to shift in how we train and prepare pastors for staffing & leadership requirements?
As with any relationship it takes two people who want a relationship to begin with. Most youth pastors hope for a relationship with their senior pastor, but seniors often don’t understand this. I suppose it helps if you like each other. If you don’t like the person you work for, it tends to reinforce isolation in unhealthy ways. I think it’s important that the staff likes each other. I also think that the way many churches hire prevent staff from seeing if there is a good chemistry before a new staff person comes on board.
I think we give too much responsibility too quickly to young inexperience youth pastors and it’s often problematic for churches and the staff. I’d like to see internships in churches for young leaders who are under 25 before they are cut loose in ministry. I’d like to see churches own the ministry before they hire youth staff. I’d like to see senior pastors be more strategically invested in youth ministry personally.
5. If there was a top five health check you could think of for both seniors/leadership boards to consider in regards to their view of youth ministry/pastors – what would it be?
1. How much pressure to do you feel to have a youth pastor in your church? If you’re your pastor left today, what would you feel and where would it come from? If you would feel something significant would stop because the staff person left, then it’s a sign that something’s not right. A church doesn’t need a youth pastor to do great youth ministry. To the extent that it suffers when a youth pastor is absent is a way of knowing how much your church is really engaged. If a church loses a youth pastor, but can go for 18 months and continue to do great ministry, without burning out the congregation, I’d say you have something very healthy.
2. For boards and staff: How many youth do you know? Really know. Their stories, what they are hoping for, what they are struggling with, etc? If your first response to that question as a board member is, “I don’t have any kids that age any more” then it’s a sign that some things wrong. It’s a disconnect. If they feel a distance between themselves and the youth ministry, it makes sense that they’d hire someone to deal with it, because the see themselves as either unqualified, or not responsible. If the board members overwhelming response are stories of kids they personally know (not just family) then it’s a sign of health.
3. When a first time guest walks into a church on a Sunday morning. Do I feel like everything is taken care of for me and that youth/children’s ministry is something that is done for them so that they can do whatever they want to do? Do I feel like no forethought has gone into greeting them and their children? Both of these are unhealthy responses. A parent who perceives their kids are an afterthought will not feel welcomed. A parent who is shown that everything is taken care of and that they aren’t needed, or expected to be involved in ministry to youth will likely get the message they children and youth ministry is something that is done for them in this church. Churches who are hospitable to first time visitors and their unique needs AND also cultivate an environment in which it’s clear that everyone is a part of the team who minister to youth and kids will sent the right message and see more adults involved in youth ministry.
4. Does the church know why it has a youth ministry? Most churches don’t know why they have a youth ministry. Most everyone you ask will be able to give you a reason, but there isn’t a cohesive well articulated reason that is owned by the church as a whole.
5. I think it would be fun to hear your reader’s number 5.
6. Likewise – what kinda questions do you think youth pastors should be asking themselves on a regular basis, in regards to their own ministry/expectations/staff relationships?
Wow. What a question!
– Does how I spend my time represent what we as a church value?
– Am I the only one who can do this? If not, why I am doing it?
– What might I unintentionally be doing that is undermining the ministry here?
– What is true about the things my biggest critics are saying about me?
– Am I using my gifts today to invest in the church to invest in kids?
– Am I really interested in what the other staff are saying? Why or why not? This is my issue not theirs, so what am I going to do about it?
– Am I being the kind of person I expect my students and adults to be?
– Am I living in a healthy rhythm?
– How can I be an advocate for the people who’s ideas I disagree with?
– What questions can I ask to unearth what others are saying without making assumptions?
That’s a good start.
7. You’re about to release a 2nd book… the unofficial church staff manual – what’s the story behind that book? When I first read Inside the mind – my immediate response was, hey – this applies to a broad section of church staff relationships.. ? Is that where it came from?
My first book, Inside the Mind of Youth Pastors, was a book written to church leaders to help them rethink youth ministry. When most church leaders talk about youth ministry, it quickly becomes a conversation about staffing. So I wrote a book that starts there for church leaders.
My second book, The (un)Official Church Staff Manual: Youth Pastor Edition, comes out officially in September and it is very different. It’s written to youth pastors in a way that they can uniquely get. It’s a cross between a Worst Case Scenario book, the Wittenberg door and a sarcastic advice book. Very short chapters. Some of it’s funny. Some is really pointed. Comedians use the phrase, “Talking to the back of the room.” It means they are telling a story, a reference or a joke that is subtly directed to the other comedians in the back of the room. It’s something of an inside joke. The book uses satire and sarcasm to indirectly make many of the same points I made in the first book. I’m tackling youth ministry with youth pastors in a fun way. It was a lot of fun to write. I’ll get a copy to you when it comes out.
8. What kind of responses are you getting from people so far?? You’re very gracious and inviting throughout the book in the way you speak directly to Seniors who are reading it. Seems like you’re trying hard not to have a “hey, listen to us youthworkers, we know what we’re talking about” attitude.
The response to the book has been very generous. A lot of Senior Pastors tell me that I’ve been reading their mail. I’ve gotten feedback from a lot of people telling me that it’s helping them and their co-workers work together better.
9. ok. so you talk a lot about the Church A and Church B models – something that is obviously close to your heart and key to the work of The Riddle Group.
If we are changing the models – or hoping to get from A to B – what changes should we expect to see – or begin to look for…
a/ in ourselves as leaders
b/ in our churches as they respond to us
c/ in our young people as we work with them
d/ in our youth pastors
What do you think we can expect to experience as church communities moving from A to B?
In church A the youth pastor is the primary spiritual former of youth. The parents drop off kids or support the youth staff as a volunteer. In Church B the parents and the church community are the spiritual formers of youth. Church B may hire a youth pastor, but it’s in an entirely different role. I think that it does mean changes for a lot of people, though I’m not sure I can tell you all of them here, nor do I pretend to grasp all of them. As more and more churches move in this direction I believe we’ll see more diverse ways of being Church B. In ourselves as leaders we no longer need to prescribe to the style of leadership big names in publishing companies tell us exemplify leadership. It means we can be ourselves. It means there will be many leaders with gifts of hospitality or mercy or shepherding able to lead in churches and feel better about it. I hope the end result for pastors in church B is relief from the burden the church has placed on them to be someone else. Our churches will change because the ethos of our communities will no longer perpetuate a consumer or victim mentality. A space where control and responsibility for faith development is given up to pastor while they feel simultaneously out of control in the local church. Young people will feel this because they will feel valued as equals in these communities and they will each be known by several adults in the church. Youth pastors will invest more and more time in the adults of the community helping them love kids and own their spiritual formation. Our churches will more rapidly embrace new ideas and be able to respond to changes they need to make.
In the states, we were committee led organizations for along time. Church leaders, especially Senior Pastors found it difficult to make changes as quickly as they would like so for the past 30 years churches moved themselves toward a more staff driven model of leadership. Where the staff make the day to day decisions regarding ministry. Staff feel more freedom, especially living in the shadow of the unintentional, overbearing, “we’ve always done it this way” committee system. However, there’s been a price to pay for this move. Staff led churches can make changes more quickly and are able to adapt to personalities centered teaching, values, or style resulting in quick growth in churches. Most of the churches folks think of as successful today are staff driven churches. What’s interesting to look at is how they create engaged people in their ministries, especially youth ministry. These churches have lots of people involved, but engagement is a different thing. Most of these churches need to hire engaged people to maintain the pace of change they need. One could argue that the very reason staff are hired in most churches is because the church itself isn’t engaged. In doing so, youth and ministry to them suffer. I could talk about this for hours. The future holds a beautiful combination of the two. That is a community who owns the ministry and lives it. A staff who uses their gifts and works together to in mission with God. I’m looking forward to hearing about these kinds of stories coming from my kiwi friends over the coming years!
Thanks so much for hosting this conversation today!
by tashmcgill | Apr 20, 2009 | Uncategorized, youth ministry
I love what Facebook does for scrapbooking and journaling people’s lives. I especially love that I can see frequently updated photos of people that I have known and loved in my lifetime.
But here’s a little story for you…
In today’s updated photos, were some new shots from a girl who was never really an ugly duckling at all. In fact, she was always talented, incredibly outgoing and vivacious. She never slighted anyone who she considered below her social status – she mixed with geeks and freaks alongside the sporty and popular kids.
Now, in her mid-20’s, she’s a knockout. She’s still an irregular height, but she has luminescent eyes. What most people don’t realise, is the stunning musical talent she has, both in voice and instrument.
I remember many late night milkshakes with her, talking about school, faith, being different people in different places. She was one of those kids at 16, you felt really belonged in the life of a 20 year old. I always liked her, thought she had real grit about her – a cliched “old soul”.
I remember commenting to a friend of mine at the time, a Christian teacher at her school, how much I had enjoyed spending time with her the night before. The replying comment with scoffing laugh, referenced this girl as the “school bike”.
I’m looking at her photograph, so beautiful, so full of life, the laughter and resonance pouring out of her. I’m thinking about the way she encouraged the less active kids on that outdoor camp and her compassion and grace with the older people at church, the ones that other kids would’ve brushed past in a moment.
I’m furious then and now with the foolishness of that teacher’s perspective. The presumption of her behaviour, good or bad. He had no idea that she was remotely involved in faith or anything like it – which showed a lack of perceptiveness also.
It made me think of Adam’s post here.
Imagine if she’d heard the tone of his voice. Imagine if she realized the perception the staff of that school had. Imagine the frailty of persona in it’s fresh new emerging forms. The ugliness of those words and that phrase… a complete contrast to the young woman engaged on screen before me. A frontier of space between the student he described and the girl I’ve known for all these years. There’s no deception here, she simply was nowhere near the girl he described, all puff and wind and smoke. Even when I spoke to her directly about it some years later – it remains clear to one who has eyes and ears, she was never any such thing.
In the last brief five minutes, I’ve had to fight back the urge to pick up the phone, to remind him with sharp words and a blistering tongue, precisely how wrong he was.
What a fool, who grasps not the beauty before him, or the foolishness of his words.
In that moment, it was he that lost my respect, and she that gained my favour. For what student ought ever, to be so condemned by one entrusted to teach, shape, guide and shepherd?
by tashmcgill | Apr 9, 2009 | Uncategorized, youth ministry
I wrote a leadership blurb recently talking about the concept of sharing knowledge, rather than hoarding it, as a method of building and developing your leadership and influence.
It’s a really important idea and a major ideological shift from boomer-type leadership strategy to egalitarian GenY-friendly model. So, increasingly, in business, church & community leadership this method of sharing knowledge is really one of opening doors and creating opportunity for others to step into the conversation, offering something of their own to the collective whole, even if it’s just presence to the conversation, that shapes and develops their own potential. All this, is influence.
Why do I think this matters? Because historically in the last thirty years, especially in ministry circles, especially in youth ministry circles – we have struggled as a collective faith body, to make spaces and develop healthy dialogue around how and why we do what we do.
So those that have struggled to find a place have moved the conversations they long for, into other, alternate spheres. This brings both great discovery, great adventure.. and sadness. Because the conversations that develop in separate worlds, by their nature, become so easily conflicted, instead of conducive to growth, mutual understanding and broadening of our worlds. As we grow new approaches to leadership – the young and emerging push and struggle for their place. But if they simply choose to separate for the long-haul – then we all suffer. Really, this is no more than stating the obvious in a more minute example of Phyllis Tickle’s theory/observation of ‘rummage sales’.
The best teaching pastors I’ve ever had and still regard, are the ones who led me along with them to their conclusions and thoughts, because sharing the process invites healthy dialogue. Sharing the process enables the asking of questions about the journey, not simply arguing over the destination and conclusion. It teaches me and teaches the teacher. So yes, Steve, I think you are right… that sharing how we think, is an engaging and critical part of this ‘wisdom’. It makes space for doubt, questions, hope, discussion and alternate endings.
Perhaps most importantly for teenagers and young adults – by sharing the ‘how’, we intimate the presence of ‘time’ in our own thinking and learning. And Time, gives permission to breathe, to question, to doubt, to argue and wrestle with for yourself. Time… one of the most beautiful gifts to youth ministry and the thing we run in fear of passing. Time to doubt, time to get it wrong, time to be learning, instead of cataloging what we have learnt.
At the end of the day, where is this most important? Where do we know this so surely from? The desire and quest for wisdom and understanding – that unique process of learning how to engage in Learning?
The endless questions of five year olds. The aching confusion of teenagers. Share what you are learning and how you are learning and un-learning it – because it gives permission to those who long to do the same.
Share wisdom, share your Learning stories – don’t settle for sharing Answers, which ultimately, may not be the answer you need to offer at all.
by tashmcgill | Apr 8, 2009 | Church, Uncategorized, youth ministry
Articles like this sometimes.
But books like Inside the Mind of Youth Pastors by my friend (presumptious?) Mark Riddle are insightful and brilliant and practical and accessible.
If you mistakenly thought this was some kind of long-awaited self-help book* for youthworkers (hey, now there is an idea for the YS bookshelves!), you would be off by a mile. But, it is in fact, a very helpful self-help book for your youth ministry and your youth staff/volunteer relationships, especially and particularly with senior church staff and leadership.
I am really grateful for Mark’s insights, reality checks and helpful approach to building honest, truthful, supportive and encouraging relationships between senior pastors and youth workers because he tackles tough issues, very real issues, in a precise and unrelenting way. Through it all, he maintains a warmth and genuine tone, where you get the sense, this guy is on your side. In fact, regardless of whether you’re a senior pastor, sole pastor, volunteer or youth pastor.. you get the feeling he’s on your side.
Chapters, Highlights, Sidenotes…You’ll Notice..
Endorsements.. There are a pile of them. And from good quality people, who come from a wide range of places and perspectives. Most praise both Mark the person and the work. Which is always a good sign. There are so many endorsements that actually – you ought to read them for their own sake.
Short Chapters.. Busy people will be reading this book, but while these short chapters are easy to read – they require thoughtful response and ask brilliant questions. My overall sense was that there are no words wasted. Stories are well placed but not overdone.
He Gets It.. Mark legitimately does get inside the mind of youthworkers from all walks and variance of experience, in addition to really understanding the driving motivations behind a lot of church youth ministry stories. He does a good job of identifying not just the wrestles of youthworkers and youth ministry, but the ongoing demands placed on senior leadership in the broader scope of church to deliver on certain expectations. And he unpacks the internal motivations of us all as leaders. *Reading this book in fact, was a little bit of a personal healthcheck.
Great Centerfold Diagrams.. This book isn’t just about seeking the Spirit and relying on discernment, feelygood feelings. No, there’s actual HR theory, relational theory and communication theory woven right through the core. Reading this book, even just the centerfold, will make you a better parent, friend, boss, employee and romantic love interest.
Discussion Questions.. From the outset, Mark addresses that you may be reading this book in order to put something in place, to instigate change, or healthy process, to invigorate and build trust with your staff team. So he gives you great, cut to core discussion questions to use, and guides you through the process of implementation and building relationship. This is like a pastoral book that wants to give you really helpful tools.
Process, Practicalities and Positioning Statements.. Mark really clearly addresses the process of deciding why, how, who, what and when that a church goes through in appointing staff, no holds barred, healthy and unhealthy, from every angle. Gives you a look to think about to fit your own circumstances into the spectrum. You’ll feel good and bad. That’s ok. He then speaks practically about basic things to get right and to avoid in the interview and employment process for both sides!! Yes, two ticks. Then he also makes some brave and brief positioning statements about practical choices.. especially in regards to ..
Catalytic Leadership (pg.78) – Most churches want the fruit of catalytic leadership, that looks to them like engaged and passionate young people ought to look, but rarely are they prepared or wanting the chaos and turmoil that a Catalytic Leader brings.
Ideal Youth Pastor Age (pg.81) – Mark puts forward a brief but well constructed, legitimate argument for maturity in youth pastors.
Healthy Churches .. – There is a clear picture of what a healthy church is/isn’t, does/doesn’t. Including the approach of self-revelation it takes in the interview and employment process.
Issues.. Ministry envy and comparison, performance anxiety, communication meltdowns.
My Own Particular Standouts And Notes
1. Characteristics of youth pastor expectations, what’s expected of them and what they expect of the job.
2. Connection between the overspiritualization and emotional connectedness that develops in the interview process.
3. The packaging doesn’t always match the product (ie: how to sell yourself article above!)
4. The Blame Game – performance anxiety and deference, role of responsibility in every aspect of leadership, including church’s responsibility.
5. This book offers invaluable insight into overall church behaviour patterns.
6. The influence of theology on staffing can take you by surprise. Reminds me of the “budget reflects the values of the church” talk I heard Brian Winslade give.
7. The importance and place of unexpressed vision in volunteers.
8. Churches do have strong values that form the organizational ideas around youth ministry, even if it’s not formally expressed in ‘vision’.
9. EXPERTISE – often churches want the approval/rhetoric of a Youth Ministry expert but only to affirm their existing plan of action.
10. Catalytic Leadership – the classic case of be careful what you wish for.
11. Ladder of Inference – often the product of relational neglect, the consequences of Isolation (relationally neutral), Alienation (relationally negative) and Condemnation (the end is near).
12. Young People – what about young people in the process? Chp 17 – 20, look at the relationship with young people.
Conclusion
The next book called the “un-Official Church Staff Manual” is going to be an excellent companion piece, because consistently “Inside the Mind” will lead you think… man, this book is really for the whole church. Not just Youth Ministry.
Check back for the blog tour later on.
by tashmcgill | Apr 7, 2009 | Uncategorized, youth ministry
I’m a naughty blogger these days – promising updates and failing to deliver, but this time I blame sickness.. so there are some of my thoughts reflections on the previous notes, just a couple of thoughts that stuck out, I’m holding them here.
Globalization – we’ve been driven by a global economic market.*
Interesting though, that while the global economy has led and driven western society to the this point, it seems there is a subliminal shift and seeking of what the drivers of society ought to be, certainly with a movement away from placing fiscal responsibility in the hands of a confidence-based market for profit. So – my pitch is that money people will have to become wiser and slower, especially as the southern hemisphere responds to the northern hemisphere “rescue packages”. Students becoming more engaged will start to use their knowledge of international economics and policy in financial planning, decision-making and eventually this will lead to a new brand of politics and government as Boomers move on.
Graduate Work Experience – Work has become a means to an end throughout student career, paid employment is to support the ‘important stuff’. Exposes the dualism present, most do not operate in a culture where work is connected to purpose.**
Starts with the allowance for chores model. Work = money = lifestyle & experience. The more redundant our education systems become with knowledge for knowledge’s sake, the more dependent people become on entertainment rather than enlightenment. Most ‘purpose’ jobs are even then, ongoing self-actualisation tasks. Working for credit, achievement, fame, glory. Offer work experiences that are fulfilling and worthwhile, the purpose/entertainment factor starts to balance out – especially taking into consideration already successful models. Consider most ‘church/faith’ programmes or community practices and what the balance is between ‘work/study/obligation’ in order to gain ‘experience/community/intimacy/relationship’. Small groups, bible study, service projects.. yet service projects are one of the fastest growing models for young adult ministry. Why? Will it be successful longterm?
Cultural Complexity – I am my own brand***
Cultural Complexity – multi ethnic diversity on campus and expanding in the wider populus****
The mosaic world we live is creates enormous questions over identity.*****
I will hopefully post more on this BUT – This area of multi-cultural multi-generationalism is absolutely fascinating to me, especially because NZ is a hotbed of continual new immigration, from Asia Pacific, South Africa, Africa and further afield. These ongoing cycles do pose interesting possibilities.
I’ve thought for a long time, that the pick’n’mix approach many students carry into their university/graduate faith is not that bad. Sure, we get frustrated with the ‘lack of commitment’ but actually this kind of ‘pick your adventure path’ attitude to defining your own identity within multicultural environments, does apply to those who select elements to build their own faith practices. (Understand I’m speaking strictly about faith practices, not beliefs.) Thus, the fabric of their spiritual community is defined by the pieces and threads they tie together.
Using the “Believe/Behave/Belong” model in unison rather than focusing on one element is a big challenge but important.******
Ok, so I just got confused here, and I’m looking for someone to correct me. I’ve only ever been exposed or conversed around the 3B’s as a way of viewing, observing the values shifting between generations. I guess the natural response of that, is to then based ministry approaches on those most present felt-needs. But I don’t think that how it was applied here was necessarily right? Essentially I think I am still more of a Youth Ministry 3.0 girl – affinity does take priority over the others.
Other Reflections
As with so many things, it’s nearly impossible to stay completely current, I’m constantly updating my own research and observations. Also, I think we also have to shift our thinking when it comes to the boundaries and definitions around youth ministry/tertiary ministry etc.
The reality is, while youth culture continues to grow in it’s domination of the 11 – 38 year old segement, the niche youth sectors become more specific.
For example, the difference in interests, fashion, music, technology, work/study balance.. these used to be points of great difference where mass groups moved in unison between these lifestages. Like when every kid from Sunday School turned 5 and started school in the same year – 12months and everyone was on the same page again.
However, think about:
Those retraining, returning to post-grad study
Those shifting jobs and career paths every 3-5 years
Those embracing marriage/children/defacto relationships/divorcing
Travelling overseas / living overseas
Buying and selling property & setting up house (Living away from the family home)
Those in vocational training rather than tertiary training
Those part-time working / part-time studying or parenting or creating
Who own and drive vehicles
Who use drugs/alcohol recreationally or habitually
Each of these aspects or areas of life could apply to anyone 15 – 40 years, because many of those critical choices being made in the tween and teen years, are now being revisited in the early adult years – but the culture remains largely the same, influenced by dominant youth culture trends. The number of 15+ having children, living independently, leaving school earlier than previously is continuing to rise.
So, if you go to trying to identify key tasks of youth ministry, I think it gets pretty easy to see, that most of it still applies to that ‘young adult’ sector. Sometimes, especially more so, as some adolescent experiences are intensified or only present in the latter stages of adolescence (smack bang in the middle of 18 – 24 years sector).
by tashmcgill | Apr 1, 2009 | Uncategorized, youth ministry
A week or so ago, I managed to squeeze in an early morning session at Massey University, with TSCF (Tertiary Students Christian Fellowship) led by Nigel Pollock, National Director, (personal blog).
It was a session for those working with 18 – 24 year olds in campus or local church environments. Nigel’s passion for faith engaging culture is evident, the thrust of his presentation being around identifying cultural/global trends and identifying the following issues for students and challenges for student ministry.
I’ve taken a bunch of notes (incomplete – as I had to leave about 5 mins before the end) but you get the idea. I agreed with a number of his points, wasn’t convinced on others and really appreciated the snapshot opportunity provided by having such a variety of ethnic, on & off-campus ministers and chaplains together.
Interact please, I’m interested to see what response you have to this stuff – especially considering the ease of being able to fall into cliche responses. I’ll post my thoughts next.
We are in a significant time of change in western culture
– connection between the world more obvious
– a time of generational watershed as babyboomers come to the end of their responsibilities.
– British Army slogan has changed over the last century from “Your Country Needs You!” to “You Need The British Army”.
– Self-fulfillment has become more important than service
– Even ministry roles is self-actualisation to one extent
– the idea of ministry being to glorify God is secondary to the utilitarian value of ministry (what fits my gifts and passions).
ISSUES AFFECTING STUDENTS 18 – 24 years.
1. Globalization
– we’ve been driven by a global economic market.*
For the first time, this economic drive is being questioned in light of current situation.
EFFECT
Student Choices for Education – philosophy/histories (Ed. – General Humanities) courses are in decline as students are encouraged to study for job choice, however this isn’t actually making them better off. Educated workforce for the sake of education doesn’t benefit, the goal of tertiary education has always been learning to think.
Student Debt – Govt policy (NZ) is user pays education. Debt is becoming an increasing issue, creating a negative cycle with cultural expectation that education is a requirement for job placement. Also creates a consumer mentality around education systems and providers.
Student Work – Majority of campus students are working 10+ hrs per week (NZ) to support the education process (ED. Not separate to the debt cycle, debt + working = head above water). The traditional university life where students engaged with sport, culture, community is changing to reflect the time available. Student experiences change generation to generation.
Graduate Work Experience – Work has become a means to an end throughout student career, paid employment is to support the ‘important stuff’. Exposes the dualism present, most do not operate in a culture where work is connected to purpose.**
CHALLENGE building students who are more than consumers and still ‘givers’ from a debt position.
2. Cultural Complexity
– changes to marriage and family templates, norms and expectations affect fabric of traditional culture and societal structures.
– internet connects and resources groups differently to traditional geographic dependant strategy.
– I am my own brand***
– multi ethnic diversity on campus and expanding in the wider populus****
ISSUES
– Connected but not relating
– Gospel unity and membership – questions of individualism and community dualism
– what does multicultural mean?
CHALLENGE
What does indigenous mission look like? The traditional model meant foreigners would ‘train’ locals to reach locals. But in an immigrant culture, what is the most appropriate model. (ED. How does Affinity impact connection points, esp. with internet based study methods?) How much of yourself do you bring to true Multiculturalism? ie: do you wear the burka or not? What does it mean for an immigrant student to become part of a multiethnic community that creates separation from the family culture? The mosaic world we live is creates enormous questions over identity.*****
– more people groups on campus
– the truth of the gospel can’t be compromised
– the culture gap between the church and society grows wider
– impact of global culture (driven by West Coast US) on indigenous peoples regardless
– STUDENTS ARE FORMING IDENTITY BASED ON GLOBAL/NATIONAL/TRIBAL instinct when engaging at university, rather than trad. forms.(ED. – tribal being based in affinity or proximity to experience)
(NB. doesn’t seem surprising that the emergence of this affinity driven identity task would appear in 18 – 25s as a ‘final stage’ of development. Seems that the Global and tribal influence on individual culture will continue to increase rather than national/ethnic boundaries.)
3. Media
– moved from being viewers, to programmers, to cyborgs
– for Gen Y, mobile phones actually form part of their identity/ or identity is in tech.
STUDENT ISSUE – Connectedness (need for it – but is it genuine?)
– Norms society>individual>family>vacuum
STUDENT ISSUE – permissiveness and despair, ie: the complexity of social ethics
– Reality is changeable, the abundance of photo-retouching when image is everything, but no image is left unaltered
STUDENT ISSUE – Self-image and awareness of reality, expectations on self and others
CHALLENGES
– Models of ministry that use network rather than hierarchy based systems (ED. Address normative identity formation and affinity more effectively, allow more flexibility)
– engaged creativity (ED. importance of contributing to the wider ‘media’)
– adoptive relationships
4. Family
– fragmentation of Gen X – move towards childfriendly protectionism within society and family structures
STUDENT ISSUE – results in removing the opportunity and requirement of leadership and initiative from the emerging generation
– complicated & extended family relationships
STUDENT ISSUE – Hurt (ED. Identity plays a part here too.)
CHALLENGES
– Using the “Believe/Behave/Belong” model in unison rather than focusing on one element is a big challenge but important.****** Preparing future parents is also key.
5. IDEAS & VALUES
– debate on nature
– God vs. Science was the defining argument of the 19th century but the question has shifted
– what does it mean to be human? Humanity – what makes us special. Decline in the humanities means that there are even fewer Christian academics studying in this field, traditionally the focus has been
in science.
– traditionally Academic Ideas influence Popular Ideas, which in turn influence further study & ongoing Academic Ideas.
– churches historically have avoided academic pursuit and have had an anti-intellectal approach to young people, but as the age of critical choices is declining from 20’s, to teens, to tweens – people are moving backwards looking for understanding and framework.
Right – so, digest, ponder, respond. I’m going to post my thoughts tomorrow – along with a review of this book…Inside the Mind Of Youth Pastors.
